Meet Ryan Williams, an Executive Coach & Keynote Speaker from San Francisco who has been to Uruguay a couple of times and experienced the IT industry first-hand. In November 2019 he was the Keynote Speaker at the most important IT business conference there: CUTI Business Forum.
What are Ryan's thoughts about the industry in Uruguay? How's the culture? What does he think about the startup founders and business executives there? Why the US should pay attention? What about the asado?
Let's dive into this episode with Ryan to know what an American business leader thinks about Uruguay.
Voice-over | 00:01 > Something is happening in South America's tech industry in particular in Uruguay. Why are there more and more US companies working with them? What is it like to work with and in Uruguay? What are the experiences, the success cases? What should you know about them? Welcome to The Kaizen Podcast where we learn tech and business insights from top leaders about Uruguay, South America and the United States IT industry. Show notes can be found at podcast.kzsoftworks.com Let's get into this show.
Fabian | 00:39 > Welcome everyone, I'm Fabian, CEO and co-founder of Kaizen Softworks and your host today. Today we are talking about what an American business leader thinks about Uruguay. For this I'm here with the executive coach and keynote speaker, the one and only Ryan Williams. Ryan, welcome to the show, Ryan.
Ryan | 01:01 > Thank you so much for having me.
Fabian | 01:04 > So Ryan, as I was saying, he's an executive coach. He's the operating partner at Ridgepeak Partners, founder of SalesCollider, has given several keynotes around the world in 12 different countries. Board member at Elite Meet, member of the Forbes official council and executive producer of the Documentary called Outside the Valley. Can you briefly let us know first, how the hell do you get the time for all this man and later exactly what you do at each?
Ryan | 01:39 > Yeah, right on. Well, I actually just got a warning on LinkedIn the other day for having too many active positions. It asked me to turn some off, but I don't see that happening anytime soon. Um, I'll, I'll break it down for you like this. I spend most of my time with high potential teams and leaders. What that looks like is as a coach, being the person who's, who's in your corner, when it's time to figure out the tough situations for your business or your career. Excuse me. And so, um, I'm based in San Francisco. I'd say probably 50% of my clients are also based here. These are high-performing software organizations, tech companies, pre IPO, or just post IPO. I just ran a recently ran a workshop for the management team at Lyft for Business. Uh, so worked with companies like a Asana, Airbnb. The founders that I work with are backed by the world's top VCs and private equity companies. So I, so I, I kind of, I've spent both the time where the executives or the founder, as they kind of turn the corner and become executives, their teams start to get bigger. Things get more complicated as well as the leaders. When, uh, when teams grow, that's often where there's a lot of stress in the business. And then at a high growth business, that means you're, you might be a new company every three to six months is what it'll feel like. Right? Um, and so that's, that's what I spend most of my time on. You want me tell you about the other stuff too? So passion project for me is a documentary called Outside the Valley. It's about startup ecosystems around the world. And I want to go deep on this, so we'll come back to it a little bit. I also, um, I believe that there's a lot of software businesses that should be funded that don't fit the traditional business model for venture. And, uh, this is the role that I have at Ridgepeak is as an operating partner and, and uh, helping the founding team go deep with the companies that we invest in. And they may not look like a traditional venture business cause maybe they're in a smaller market or really niche and kind of, uh, being smart about doing one thing really, really well. But I come in to work with those companies on business strategy, finding the right advisors, figuring out sales, figuring out growth. And that's what I've been doing the last 12 years is working with companies to figure out growth.
Fabian | 04:01 > And what did you get all these experience, uh, from, well, what is your, your background, your trajectory in the U S IT industry?
Ryan | 04:12 > Well that's a tough, that's a tough question to answer. So I would say that, you know, the short piece of my background is I've always looked for ways to help other people and that just, that was ingrained in my family growing up by the age of four or five, I had to go shovel snow off of my, sorry, should I back up? Do you know what snow is?
Fabian | 04:31 > Yeah.
Ryan | 04:32 > Okay. Cause I, every time I go to Uruguay, it's so freaking nice down there. And imagine you guys ever knowing snowy winter.
Fabian | 04:38 > Yeah, I know. I've been to a couple of places with it.
Ryan | 04:43 > Yeah. So I'm just kidding. But you know, it's a pain in the ass, right? So my, my dad would wake me up on Saturday morning and say it's time to go shovel the walk and uh, and clean up the driveway for the neighbor. And uh, her name was Mrs Harder. And so it was, it was always time to go clean up Mrs Harder's driveway. And, uh, but what I learned from that is really just, you know, you, you see what you can do to help someone else out, especially if you've got something they need. And I started my career as actually as a teacher and then a social worker. I raised a bunch of money for the boys and girls club of Chicago, a mentoring program that works in some of Chicago's roughest neighborhoods. And after that role, I started to think about how do I get technology more involved in my career. And that brought me to San Francisco. And my first, my first couple of jobs here were we're in Silicon Valley working for a web production agencies as well as, uh, advertising startups. And, and that's really the carryover for me was continuing to ask, Hey, what does somebody else need? Whether that's a customer or a colleague or eventually as a manager that's asking that same question of your team, what do they need from me as a leader? And, and that's the, the only arc, uh, between all these different things is just thinking about how to be of service for other folks.
Fabian | 06:06 > Very intersting. So getting a little into the, the topic of today, how many times have you been to, to Uruguay and how did you end up there? What was the story behind it?
Ryan | 06:19 > Well, like most Americans, I haven't been enough. Anybody had been there, has known that Uruguay is a special place. And although it's a very small country, uh, it's hard to see everything that it has to offer. So I've been twice now. And I'll tell you for me the first time I even, you know, had heard about it, I was giving a keynote in Japan and the program was a accelerator program sponsored by, uh, 500 startups. VC is based here in San Francisco who does programs all over the world. And so I found myself in Kobe, Japan giving the closing keynote to the first week of the accelerator. And as I got off stage, I thought they were going to fire me. The program manager looked a little frustrated. The translators looked super frustrated if, and uh, when I walked up to the program manager, I said, Hey, you know, how was that thinking he was going to scold me for talking too fast, being too direct with Japanese business people. I curse a lot. And so I figured for sure they were going to say, get out of here as fast as you can. And, uh, and I found out that frustrated look what was, because he was trying to figure out how I could come to all of his programs and he said, if I send you a plane ticket, can you meet me in Uruguay in six weeks? And of course I said, where's Uruguay? Uh, and, and he explained that it was in South America and, and that I would, I would love it. Um, I, I got on a plane and I went and did a similar similar workshop for a group of founders there that was sponsored by a couple of the cool agencies you have there on the in LATU and 500 startups. They, so about two years ago they put out a, essentially a pre accelerator to help companies in Uruguay think about how to come to the US market if they're coming to get involved at a VC backed accelerator. Since then, several of those companies have gotten a chance to interview at Y Combinator, 500 startups. And so, um, that was a program that brought me there. Um, but I just, I fell in love with the people.
Fabian | 08:19 > And what do you think and like about the country? And let's start with the Asado.
Ryan | 08:26 > Start with the Asado? The Asado is the best part, man. So what happened for me is I had made a joke about how I had great food in Argentina and I didn't realize how often. So that was until someone said, you will cancel your flight and come to my home. And one of the entrepreneurs that I was meeting with is, you know, I was, I was like, okay, well, I guess at the dinner party I get there and it's like 20 people and the grill, the Parrilla is the size of probably my whole house. Um, huge outdoor grill. Uh, tons of camaraderie, tons of friends all coming over. And, uh, well the thing that I noticed about Uruguayan people is that they make friends so quickly, not just, you know, with the American is in, from out of town, but also with each other. I started to realize that the entrepreneurs that come to this gathering, because I was, that they were, they all heard the message that I was being shown what an Asado is. Um, uh, me and a couple of the other guests were from, one guy is, is a Thai American living in London and another guy's Spanish living in London. And so all three of us were, were brought over to this house to be shown how to, how to really enjoy, uh, the, the meat of Uruguay. And so, um, yeah, there was just an unforgettable experience. Right. And it's a few things, right? There's, I have noticed this last trip that people divide the Asado talk into two parts. One is the way that the Asado was prepared, the, the way the fire is made and then the way the meats are laid out and cooked in the right order so that they all get done the right way and then they all get shared and passed. And then the other thing, it seems like a Asado, and you can tell me if this is what it means, but it seems like a Asado has this other meaning of this kind of like a flat community of people coming together as peers equals sharing the same food, eating off the same plate, sharing wine, drinking the beautiful Tannat that you have down there. And it's just more of a, a gathering of equals and, and just really kind of a shared experience. And it seems to me that you can't have one without the other kind of process. Um, which is cool.
Fabian | 10:33 > It's about sharing. Uh, spend some time with family, friends. It's a great moment for every Uruguayan, uh, to share. So we really enjoy Asado and not only because of the food, but also because of the time you spend there.
Ryan | 10:48 > I think most Americans wouldn't realize how many different types of meat are actually involved in this. It's probably, you know, 10 or 20, depending on who's who's hosting. What's your favorite type Fabi?
Fabian | 10:59 > Uh, "Asado de tira" is the type of Asado that I really like. But yeah, you're right. There's different types of it and the way we cook it and until which point. Very well done Asado.
Ryan | 11:15 > Yeah.
Fabian | 11:16 > So, and I guess the people and the Asado made you come again for a second time in Uruguay. And this time it was in November, 2019 one month ago. Uh, where you opened the CBF or Cuti Business Forum, a conference made by the Uruguayan IT Chamber in Uruguay, and you made a Keynote titled go big or stay home. Do you, do Uruguayan companies have what they need to go big for you?
Ryan | 11:50 > Well, I think the first thing you kind of do is break down What does it mean to go big? It's so I think going big is when you go with such commitment as whether it's into the market or into the business that you're starting. When you go with that kind of commitment, uh, you go in and you take a lot of risks and um, and I think that there is a choice now. There's a common phrase, go big or go home. And that implies going home after you've already started down the path. And I don't think that we should put one foot in and then change our mind and then get out of it. Not when it comes to, especially Uruguayan companies when they decide that it's time to go after building a big IT, uh, product company, right? So I'm talking about, Hey, we're going to make software that changes the world. Let's not do that with one foot in, um, this, the, the services that are needed to get you there are all over Uruguay. You know, you guys have some great service companies. I think you've got some, some personal experience with running some awesome, uh, IT outsourcing services in. Um, so you have the tools that are needed, but, um, but not quite the tenacity. And that's what I see. I see this a lot of places outside the outside Silicon Valley, um, which we'll talk a little bit about my project outside the Valley here, but, um, but I think yes, absolutely Uruguayans have what they need. Um, but the piece is, it's, it's around making that choice to, to be tenacious and go after that market. I would say kind of at all costs. But what I don't want to have happen is people just to have money to just dip my toe in here and start a small side project. Um, side projects, uh, stay side projects, right. The side hustle. It's very hard to make that your full time thing. And, and that's, that's a real challenge when, you know, you build on the infrastructure of how, where it's been half of our time on the services business and half of our time on the product. Right.
Fabian | 13:49 > So about the conference, what, what do you think about the event? I heard it was one of the most important talks you deliver so far. Was there like 700 or even more people?
Ryan | 13:59 > Yeah. Well one, I wasn't ready for that many people. I thought it was great for the entire population of Uruguay and so I was like, wow, they all, they all showed up. Um, but, uh, but yeah, so I've done workshops and talks around the world for the last five years. I've, I figured it out the other day. Somebody had asked me, I've done over 2,600 hours of training talks and workshops and facilitation in the last five years. That's been in 14 countries, that's been with over 400 CEOs and it's been at accelerators, everything from founders who are backed by Y Combinator in Google, uh, 500 startups, Techstars, as well as guys that are just getting started at a garage and everything in between. And I could tell you stories about, uh, from Turkey to Japan and Singapore to, uh, all over Europe. Um, and then a couple of spots there in South America, Argentina, and Uruguay. Um, and what I can tell you though, is in doing all of those workshops, I wasn't prepared for the different sensation that it is to be a main stage keynote to open a conference. I think there's a reason why bands have openers. Um, and so now I know that, you know, my job might've just been being the warmup act. Uh, and, and, but I tried to go and give it my all and it was, uh, it was one of the coolest talks I've ever been a part of because I've never really been in front of that size crowd. And so it was super energizing to see, you know, 700 people there and, and uh, and folks received really well. Um, had a lot of people follow up on LinkedIn. You can find me on LinkedIn.com/in/JRyanWilliams and um, you could see some of the posts there. And you'll see in my most recent posts is about, uh, this event and how cool it was for me to be a part of, even though it did bring a lot of nervous energy to see that big of a crowd.
Fabian | 15:50 > And what about if you were to give a keynote in the US about Uruguay, what would be the title of it? Go big or eat Asado?
Ryan | 16:04 > Ah, I would say, you know, prioritize the Asado. Um, no, I mean, aside from like the cultural stereotypes of, you know, Uruguay being beautiful beaches and great food. I think if I were to try to give a talk here to energize audiences about what's happening right now in Uruguay, it would probably be something about a undiscovered market. Right? So. I've been all over the world and I'm surprised at how big of an opportunity there is in Spanish speaking Latin America. It's something like 0.01% of venture capital dollars make it to Spanish speaking Latin American countries, but 10% of the internet users, right? So if you think about that, at some point the, the internet users start demanding to use tools that are built for them that are native for their experience, their culture, their, um, their language, right? You've got so many different versions of Spanish that's like, let's make a login screen then, you know, is universal now. Sure. Products. I think, you know, the digital age, you know, you've got a culture who's really ready to embrace technology. I, one other thing that surprised me about about Uruguay is, um, uh, what is it a Plan Ceibal where you've got one laptop per child. So for the last 10 years, every kid in Uruguay has had a computer to use.
Fabian | 17:25 > One of the most important programs we have here for sure.
Ryan | 17:29 > Yeah. So we talk about, you know, Hey, America's this great tech Mecca and especially you've got do a good job of keeping that, you know, that reputation for Northern California, Silicon Valley and San Francisco. But I didn't have that experience growing up. My kids are not having that experience. They're fighting for times on their iPads at home. Sure. That's, and that is privileged, but they don't have that same level of technology support that you guys are giving your kids in school. My kids get it maybe an hour a week, uh, as opposed to a laptop. You take home, you learn how to take care of, you learn how to code for, you learn how to load programs for. And I think that's really impressive, right? Like to be able to have that kind of national commitment to technology. Um, I think that would shock most people in the U S because you're not going to go find that, you know, where my parents live in Texas or you know, in Alabama or in New York or in my school here in San Francisco. You don't see that same commitment because it's such, it's much harder to have a national commitment. Um, and so, uh, uh, with more people. So there's a huge opportunity being a kind of smaller economy to make that plan and say, we're going to double down on this. And I know Plan Ceibal does some other things too. But that was the thing that stuck out to me. It basically means that somewhere in the next five years, you guys are going to have over half a million people enter the workforce who had a computer over 10 years in their life.
Fabian | 18:54 > That's going to be like huge.
Ryan | 18:57 > Yeah. So one I would remind you is doubled down on native products, right services industries, yet, you know, have the opportunity to, uh, you know, serve the world, which is going to happen and keep happening from the dominant services community there in Uruguay. But also, you know, the things that you can learn by building products and infrastructure that are specific to that culture and that environment is something I would think about doubling down on. But you know, if I were to give a talk in the U S it would be, you know, Uruguay is underrated and uh, if anybody came to it then they would, you know, find, find the things that, uh, that I've seen, which is, you know, gorgeous beaches, great food, amazing people, and a lot more technology than, than you'd expect. What I've seen other places. Yeah, totally. I think it is, and maybe this is just kind of the, what you come back to is just, I was thinking about, I was thinking about what a cool opportunity it is to, to kind of see a Uruguay evolve and most places that if you go and you evaluate the startup ecosystems, like I've been doing these 14 other countries, what I'm seeing is the ones that are more advanced are tend to be the ones that have a density of entrepreneurs too. Who had some kind of exits. They're acting as angel investors, they're starting funds. And this was pointed out to me actually by the chief innovation officer for the state of Colorado here in the U S we were meeting, and we're talking about the development of the movie that we're working on outside the Valley. And, and Eric had pointed out that that density of the entrepreneurs who've done it before really changes what that startup ecosystem is. And so when you talk about San Francisco, we talk about Boston, you know, the, the amount of exits, um, that exist, Boston, New York, San Francisco, that's really where, where the startup communities are going. Oh man, this, you know, I can, I can see someone's done this before. But one thing I've seen in, in Uruguay, which is the shocking factor for me is the density of entrepreneurs who are setting out on the early side of that journey. Right? The same way that I kind of, I was pointing out that the number of people who, who are digitally native and been around technology from, from school are now entering the workforce in the next few years. You know, it's almost half a million people think about all the companies that are in there that are at the early stages. And so as long as people don't get discouraged, as long as people keep starting up and keep doing it, they're going to learn those first few steps and, and then the funding sources are going to follow it. They're going to start to see the amazing company they're in double time. That's a thing that I think if I had to say one thing to the, to the U S market is to take notice of that because we don't have that density of people starting companies, um, outside of California in the US uh, we definitely have that here in California, but, um, but I'd say that that energy is, is matched, uh, in Uruguay and only a few other places in the world.
Fabian | 21:53 > Cool, interesting view. So, Hey everyone, we hope you're enjoying the show. We would like to take just a moment to thank our company for making this content possible.
Voice-over | 22:02 > Most of the companies fail due to running out of money. Tech-based wages are higher than ever. On average, it takes six months to find the right talent in the US. These are some of the reasons why 65% of the US small businesses will outsource services to other companies during the year. Nearshore options like Kaizen Softworks, tackle all these problems, find out more at kzsoftworks.com.
Fabian | 22:29 > So Ryan, what differences and similarities do you find between the US and Uruguay business cultures?
Ryan | 22:38 > Well, the, I mean, like we were talking about before, like the ability to start, uh, you know, just getting out there and starting a company, um, and starting a technology, uh, entrepreneurship venture. I, I definitely see that same momentum that it's here in California. I see that same type of momentum there in Uruguay, which is really cool. I don't see that in other places in the US which is why I kind of be specific to California. What are founders that I worked with from Portugal, moved to the US and said he's, he was treating it as almost 50 different countries. Uh, and, and because the cultures are so different as he's sold into companies in New York and companies in, uh, you know, Georgia and companies in Texas and whatnot, they were all acting so differently that he really treated that way. So I would just clarify that. I mean, in California we have a lot of kids who are going, yeah, I'm going to start a company. We don't quite have that everywhere yet, but we have that in Uruguay too, which has roots. It's really cool to see.
Fabian | 23:37 > So if you, if you had to say two or three words about the Uruguayan business executive and founder, uh, how would you describe them? Tough question?
Ryan | 23:53 > Yeah. I mean, it's tough question because you're asking for some generalizations when I haven't met everybody yet. I have managed to eat Asado with at least half the country at this point because they keep showing up places. But, um, I would say a couple of things, right? The, the, I would say that, um, there's a humility and a curiosity that exists that almost kind of is, is, uh, and I don't mean this in a pejorative way. I mean this sort of positive way, uh, it's almost childlike. The kind of early stages of, Hey, how does this work? How does that work? That, that curiosity that, that, um, that a lot of times we hide from in the US right. That curiosity of, Hey, how do you make this work is a hard thing to express when, uh, you want to seem like you're on top of the world and ready to raise the next round. Um, because there, there isn't that pressure to how do I raise the next funding round cause you don't have the same density of VCs there. There's the entrepreneurs that I meet with are a little more humble and open and saying, Hey, how does this work? Or how does that work? Or how should I do this? Or what do you think of this? Um, which are great questions to ask.
Fabian | 25:07 > So before closing the show, let's quickly go to your documentary Outside the Valley. Can you briefly tell us what's it all about and why did you start it?
Ryan | 25:21 > Yeah. So it was actually, um, after my trip to Uruguay, I managed to do this amazing thing that I don't know many people know about, which was take a water ferry, uh, across the water from Uruguay to Argentina Buquebus. And, uh, what I, I, I, I got a chance to spend some time in Buenos Aires after this kind of weird, but yet amazing boat, ferry ride. And um, I enjoyed spending time with NXTP accelerator as well as Endeavor's office and Buenos Aires. And when I got back to the US I was really pumped about my trip and somebody asked me what I was doing and I was like, Oh, I was speaking in Uruguay and I also went to an accelerator in Argentina and the, the executive that I was talking to here in the States said, Oh, you're mistaken. There are no accelerators in Argentina. That was weird. It was like, well, no, no, no. Let me tell you about these guys, you know, NXTP. And I'd tell him about Endeavor and I'd tell him what we were doing in Uruguay with 500 and ANII and LATU and the local momentum that you guys have there. And uh, and he just laughs. He goes, no, no, no, you don't get it. There's no accelerators there. I mean, anywhere in South America. I was like, wow. It seems like that's pretty close way to think about it. Um, and then a few months later I was returning from a trip that I had where I was at an accelerator in Rome called Peak Campus. They do amazing stuff. They've got five houses in, in the Roman suburbs, and they've got in these five houses, five companies work under Marco Trombetta, he and his partner Luca, and they're just doing awesome stuff there. So I came back from that trip and again, somebody else is a different person. I said, I was just as this accelerator in Italy. He goes, Oh, there's no good companies in Italy. And I was like, bam, this is a pretty closed mindset, right? For people who talk about, you know, having this growth mindset, building companies being agile, they've got this impression. Many people are, have this impression that this is the only place where technology happened. There are no good companies in other places. And so I just started to circulate more and more thought around how great companies can come from anywhere. And when I shared that with a good close college friend Hunter Weeks, who's the, uh, very experienced documentarian, he's got eight projects that have been on Netflix. And I was telling him about these talks and these places I've been, and he's been to some of these same same markets and entrepreneur himself. He goes, man, there's a real story here we should share with the world. Uh, this story about how great companies can come from anywhere. And so we're, we're, we're doing our project in five markets, spending time with founders, uh, to tell what's happening in that ecosystem. And so part of my last trip in November to Uruguay was to spend time with a couple of founders there and it's share the story and see what's going on. We've spent time in Portugal, we've spent time in Mexico City with uh, two ladies who are changing the face of eCommerce and, uh, we have some plans to spend some time in Oceania and Southeast Asia, um, very soon. So it's going to be a really interesting story when it all comes together and I can't wait to come back on the show and promote the movie.
Fabian | 28:36 > It's a fantastic job. You are doing there. When, when do you think is going to be released? Do you have any, any dates?
Ryan | 28:42 > We're probably, we're probably gonna see it in spring or summer of 2020. It takes a lot longer than you'd think. But, uh, with a project like this, we want to make sure we do it right. And we also have the right partners, um, that, uh, film festivals or distribution partners all lined up and we've had a couple of really exciting talks with some of the big distribution channels that everybody has heard of here in the US um, and so we're, we've got nothing to announce yet, but we're getting very close to to that. But if anybody is interested in and how they can get involved with the project at the sponsor level, there's still a few opportunities for that.
Fabian | 29:19 > Cool. And about the recordings you made in Uruguay what were they about?
Ryan | 29:26 > Yeah, so we interviewed, uh, these founders and we had a chance to spend time with influencers from, uh, places like ANII, uh, which, you know, been doing some great work with funding and backing companies. Uh, we've talked to some of the, um, the folks who are on the kind of company builder or incubator side, a few few folks there who shared their stories. And then also we've, we spent a lot of time learning about the culture, spending time on the beach and seeing stuff. So I got the chance to try to finally see this thing they call Punta del Este.
Fabian | 30:03 > Do you like it?
Ryan | 30:04 > The rumor, rumors about it. Uh, I heard Jay Z would be out there. He wasn't there yet. So Jay and Beyonce, they didn't text me back. So I don't think they're down yet for the season, but I've got a chance to see, Punta del Este. Um, and then also experienced a magical place called Cabo Polonio. Have you spent any time there Fabian?
Fabian | 30:22 > Yeah, of course. I love it. I probably will be there in January doing surfing all the month.
Ryan | 30:32 > So here's the reason why I don't trust Uruguayans because here's the thing, I go down there in October two, two years ago and they go, man, the weather's really good here. Starting in November. You should come back. I come back two years later in November and they go, man, the weather's really good here in December or January, you should come back.
Fabian | 30:52 > We always want you to come back, man.
Ryan | 30:55 > Yeah, it's working. We'll just come down there and take a while and uh, acclimate work on my Spanish, see if I can get, get my yoga scouting more like a show and then, uh, spend some more time with folks.
Fabian | 31:13 > Cool. We got Asado and good beaches, man. So, yeah, whenever you want.
Ryan | 31:22 > It's been great sharing stories with you and I look forward to, uh, keeping up and, and, and hearing everything that's released
Fabian | 31:29 > Sure. If the audience wants to reach out to you, how can they find you?
Ryan | 31:35 > If they're checking out my content, the best way to do it is follow me on LinkedIn, which is linkedin.com/in/JRyanWilliams. Maybe you can add a link to that in the show notes. That's the community I'm spending most time on. I'm not really active with Twitter or Facebook or any of that stuff anymore. All my business stuff is there on LinkedIn. I share talks or or links to other resources.
Fabian | 31:57 > Excellent. Ryan, thanks a lot for your time man to be here with us today and thanks everyone for listening to this episode and thanks, uh, for being our guest man.
Ryan | 32:08 > Hey, gracias amigo!
Voice-over | 32:11 > Thanks for listening to The Kaizen Podcast. This podcast has been brought to you by Kaizen Softworks. You can learn more about us at kzsoftworks.com.